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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2019 9:24 pm 
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Greetings Fellow CTC Warriors,

I'm thrilled with the relaunch of the national forum and very much looking forward to collaborating with all of you in here. I've been with CTC now for 3 years filing accurate educated tax returns and have received one state victory for tax year 2016, (FIRST IN THE STATE!) and a partial victory from the feds for 2017 which you may have seen posted in the news..

My federal filings, for 2016 and amended filings for 2014 and 2015 have been unilaterally deemed "frivolous", although, they are far from anything related to "installment agreements", "offers in compromise" and "tax payer assistance orders", or anything of the like to be found in IRS publication 2010-33 the IRS has been quick to threaten me with unlawful penalties and mailings of every kind asserting these false pretexts in order to scare me into controverting my testimony.

I take each and every false assertion by the IRS as an opportunity to dissect the operations of the agency, seizing every moment to rebut their false pretexts and assertions. I have successfully thwarted their every attempt to levy my property and impose unlawful penalties. Had I been returned my property with no hassle I may have been less apt to get down to brass tax and learn the administrative and legal dictates of the agency, and thanks to Pete's work as well as all your contributions to the CTC community at Losthorizons the process of discovery I've experienced has been and continues to be illuminating, exciting, and of the utmost empowering.

I'm excited for this opportunity to collectively unite with all of you across the nation as we work diligently in defense of the rule of law restraining those in abuse of their PRIVILEGED powers. Together we can restore the founders republic as they envisioned after all, we have inherited the responsibility.

I leave you with these find words from whom other than, Thomas Paine:

“Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered; yet we have this consolation with us, that the harder the conflict, the more glorious the triumph. I love the man that can smile in trouble, that can gather strength from distress, and grow brave by reflection. 'Tis the business of little minds to shrink; but he whose heart is firm, and whose conscience approves his conduct, will pursue his principles unto death.”
― Thomas Paine


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 10, 2019 10:37 pm 
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Hi James,

I'm currently rebutting 4 FRPs along with a Notice of Intent to Levy. My FOIA requests for the FRPs has dragged on for 4 months now as they keep sending me letters stating they need more time. Now that the IRS offices are open again, I have an appt on March 1st to go in to my local office with my witness to demand the sames docs as requested in FOIA.

My situation is unique in the fact that I didn't file for 15 years and then hired an enrolled agent to file for me for those 15 years. I was then introduced to CtC and decided to file amended educated filings for all of those years. The hilarious thing is, and to demonstrate how f'd up the IRS is, the FRPs they assessed me are for my original 1040s, NOT the 1040X educated filings! The 3176C letters I received stated, "we determined your return filed on 2/1/18..." when in reality the referenced return was filed some 15 months prior! Of course they meant to send me a 3176C for my 1040X but instead they put 1040 on the 3176C... so f'd up and just shows how unorganized and unethical they are!

So you say you successfully thwarted their every attempt. With the success you had, did you simply respond to the 3176C letters and they went away? Or did you receive an actual $5k FRP or Notice of Intent to Levy?


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:59 pm 
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Chad Hershey wrote:
Hi James,

I'm currently rebutting 4 FRPs along with a Notice of Intent to Levy. My FOIA requests for the FRPs has dragged on for 4 months now as they keep sending me letters stating they need more time. Now that the IRS offices are open again, I have an appt on March 1st to go in to my local office with my witness to demand the sames docs as requested in FOIA.

My situation is unique in the fact that I didn't file for 15 years and then hired an enrolled agent to file for me for those 15 years. I was then introduced to CtC and decided to file amended educated filings for all of those years. The hilarious thing is, and to demonstrate how f'd up the IRS is, the FRPs they assessed me are for my original 1040s, NOT the 1040X educated filings! The 3176C letters I received stated, "we determined your return filed on 2/1/18..." when in reality the referenced return was filed some 15 months prior! Of course they meant to send me a 3176C for my 1040X but instead they put 1040 on the 3176C... so f'd up and just shows how unorganized and unethical they are!

So you say you successfully thwarted their every attempt. With the success you had, did you simply respond to the 3176C letters and they went away? Or did you receive an actual $5k FRP or Notice of Intent to Levy?


Thanks for sharing, Chad.

Great idea visiting your local office with a witness. I too had a similar experience with the IRS disclosure offices over FOIA requests for my internal transcripts. When I visited my local TAO I sat around for an hour trying to tell them which transcripts I was looking for and all it came down to was them supplying me with the standard transcripts found via the IRS online portal, and they also had NO CLUE what a 620b substitute return was.

To answer your question, YES. By that I mean, I have NOT had any property levied thus far. I did receive multiple unsigned FRP penalties for each year 14,15, and 16. I believe I'm up to around 37K total ALLEGEDLY owed. I did rebut each assertion (3176C + C15s) individually as I received them. After calling and stating I believe these penalties have been unlawfully imposed I was sent form CP504 through which I pursued "Collections Due Process" through form 12153,ultimately led me in "frivolous" circles and no body has yet to prove by my request that somewhere somebody has taken responsibility for these penalties, and that I'm liable for them in anyway shape or form. Then, I discovered through lost horizons a form 12153 "taxpayer" CDP request is not need to proceed in Collections due process. A few days ago I received an acknowledgement that my information was received, but not surprisingly it will be 90 days before I hear back from them..

It's all delay and evasion, seems to be their go to tactic. I'll admit, I made some mistakes in correspondences with them by arguing law and so.. I have learned to keep my replies short and sweet and add elements in which require their acknowledgement by a given time period and refusal to ultimately means there's no real liability.. ultimately, I have to say the writings on the wall for me and before time is up I will not hesitate to complain loud and clear to the federal district court.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2019 11:24 pm 
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James,

So your visit to your local office was to request the same forms you requested via FOIA, correct?

- Forms 12775 and 8278;
- TXMODA, and any other internal use transcript(s) showing "Control Base and History Information" for MFT>55;
- Any internal use transcript(s) indicating that an IRC § 6020(b) Return was prepared by I.R.S. for MFT>30 and/or MFT>55?

If so, none of these forms were produced during your visit? Did you go with a witness to verify they didn't have the docs?

Pete has said, "walk into your nearest IRS office (with a witness to hear them tell you they haven't any of the docs you seek, if they don't give them to you-- an admission just as good as the docs themselves, in regard to the 8278, 12775 and 6020(b) documentation). More and more people are having to do that, since the "disclosure officers" are getting more and more balky. But walking in has worked for everyone, so far... Any denial that the docs exist is good enough. There you will either be given the docs or be told there are none to give."

You write, "I pursued "Collections Due Process" through form 12153" ... "Then, I discovered through lost horizons a form 12153 "taxpayer" CDP request is not need to proceed in Collections due process."

This is a little vague and not making sense to me, can you please explain further... are you saying you pursued a CDP hearing by by filing IRS form 12153 and then you discovered that you do not need to file form 12153 to request a Collection Due Process hearing?


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2019 8:43 pm 
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Chad,

Yes the same forms and they seemed to have no idea what I was talking about, at one point the lady asked me if I was a business, in regards to the 620b request. No, I did not go with a witness, BIG MISTAKE! I'm making an appointment tomorrow. I will also be certain to get the names of the folks..

I somehow overlooked Pete's admonishment in that regard!!

In regards to CDP hearing request, pursuant to Notice CC-2016-19 as published by the Office of Chief Counsel in its ‘Collections Due Process Handbook’ dated August 16th, 2006 under 2. Procedures for requesting a CDP hearing, a request for a hearing may be written without the use of a FORM 12153 so long as the request “be in writing and include the taxpayer’s name, address, and daytime telephone number, and be dated and signed by either the taxpayer or the taxpayer’s authorized representative”.

You can find this notice on the companion CD.

Let me expound the situation for you, On my first CDP hearing request via form 12153 my reason for the request was Challenging all liabilities.. a valid issue exemplified by the form 12153 instructions - which says, "Other Reasons—'I am not liable for (I don't owe) all or part of the taxes.' You can raise a disagreement about the amount you owe only if you did not receive a deficiency notice for the liability (a notice explaining why you owe taxes—it gives you the right to challenge in court, within a specific time frame, the additional tax the IRS says you owe), or if you have not had another prior opportunity to disagree with the amount you owe.

T.Salinas in C.A., the settlement officer handling my case replied to my first request claiming the issues I raised are "frivolous", citing 3 bullet points that claimed the issues I raised are "frivolous" and if I do not amend my request she will return my case to collections (sound awfully similar?). At the end of her notice she cited "valid" issues which she recommended I reference for my amended request, one of which was "I am not liable for (I don't owe) all or part of the taxes".

After replying to that nonsense and attempting to contact her via telephone three times leaving messages twice, "she" responded yet again by mail claiming the issue I'm raising is frivolous as found in 2010-33, or because of a reason NOT found in 2010-33 or a "reflection of a desire to delay or impede federal tax administration" and returned my case to collections where I received my 2nd CP504 for all three years. I say "she" because under the signature line of the 2nd notice from collections is "Teshawna M. Woods" but the notice was signed by a Linda Somebody or another..

I hope I've painted a clear enough picture of the situation.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 10:58 am 
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Joined: Mon Mar 23, 2009 5:15 pm
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So you received Frivolous Return Penalties, you rebutted those FRPs, after rebutting the FRPs they still sent you CP504, you rebutted CP504 with CDP form 12153; they denied your CDP form and sent you back to collections and you now received your second CP504 for the FRPs they assessed you... is this a correct overview?

If so, basically... even though they have not pursued any collection/levy action against you for these FRPs, they still have not acknowledged your rebuttals and hence have yet to officially -0- out your account?

Isn't it amazing and yet so frustrating that they cannot give you a straight answer as to why your return(s)/rebuttals/paperwork are considered Frivolous!? You stated "she" responded yet again by mail claiming the issue I'm raising is frivolous as found in 2010-33, or because of a reason NOT found in 2010-33 or a "reflection of a desire to delay or impede federal tax administration"... Found in, not found in or blah, blah... simply mind-boggling! If our returns and/or what we are saying in our rebuttals are even close to Frivolous, then why can't they give us an exact reason as to why!!??

Just curious, what were you going to say to her if you get her on the phone?

**********

Side note, do you know how to turn on notifications for these posts, so I get notified via email when a reply is posted?

Also, I can send you the docs I plan on taking in with me when I go to by local office, can we add attachments here or can I PM you attachments?


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 8:08 pm 
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That is correct, chad.

To answer your second question that is correct as well.

It's pure delay and evasion. The clock is ticking and they know that. An action must be brought against them in the district court. There's no other way by not doing so is to acquiesce. I'm building my case and as soon as I get my hands on the MF transcripts I'll be writing a a complaint In Propria Persona .

I've never had any luck getting through to anybody who can actually make things happen for my situation over the phone, at least that's their claim. I don't expect she'll ever call me nor will I be able to get through to her.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 8:31 pm 
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Also, here is the link to FRP on Losthorizons : http://losthorizons.com/FRP.htm

If you haven't already digested all the information contained in that page be certain to!

I do not know how to turn on mobile notifications from this forum. If you can PM to me that would be fine. I'm not entirely sure how to attach a doc. to this forum or if it's even possible.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 9:25 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 08, 2009 11:58 pm
Posts: 10
Hi James:

Jeff here. New to the forum. I noticed that you said that Appeals denied your request for a CDP hearing. Under what grounds? Did they provide you with a "Notice of Determination" that advised you of your right to challenge their determination in Tax Court? By law they are required to provide you with this in order to protect your right to due process.


Last edited by Jeff Rische on Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 13, 2019 11:08 pm 
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From my understanding, while Appeals has the authority to deny you a CDP hearing, they must advise you of your right to seek judicial review of that determination.

You should read the Q&A text from: https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/26/301.6330-1

Q-E8. How will Appeals issue its determination?

A-E8. (i) Taxpayers will be sent a dated Notice of Determination by certified or registered mail. The Notice of Determination will set forth Appeals' findings and decisions. It will state whether the IRS met the requirements of any applicable law or administrative procedure; it will resolve any issues appropriately raised by the taxpayer relating to the unpaid tax; it will include a decision on any appropriate spousal defenses raised by the taxpayer; it will include a decision on any challenges made by the taxpayer to the appropriateness of the collection action; it will respond to any offers by the taxpayer for collection alternatives; and it will address whether the proposed collection action represents a balance between the need for the efficient collection of taxes and the legitimate concern of the taxpayer that any collection action be no more intrusive than necessary. The Notice of Determination will also set forth any agreements that Appeals reached with the taxpayer, any relief given the taxpayer, and any actions the taxpayer or the IRS are required to take. Lastly, the Notice of Determination will advise the taxpayer of the taxpayer's right to seek judicial review within 30 days of the date of the Notice of Determination.

Q-E10. Why is the Notice of Determination and its date important?

A-E10. The Notice of Determination will set forth Appeals' findings and decisions with respect to the matters set forth in A-E1 of this paragraph (e)(3) [see above]. The 30-day period within which the taxpayer is permitted to seek judicial review of Appeals' determination commences the day after the date of the Notice of Determination.

Did you receive a "Notice of Determination" via certified mail?


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2019 8:37 am 
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Hey Jeff,

Thanks for the additional info, the ground with which my CDP request was denied was based entirely on the unfounded allegations that the issue I raised in my request was a frivolous argument and not a "valid" issue. Like I mentioned earlier in this thread the issue I raised was that of challenging liability as I do not believe I owe all the taxes. A valid issue in the instructions for the CDP request, and as cited by the settlement officer in her notice asking me to amend my request.

No I have not receive a "notice of determination". Again, thank you for this info this will come in really handy!

On another note, I have an appointment with the TAO today at 2pm. I am bringing a witness with me!

I will update you fellas later on with my results.

Cheers


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2019 5:22 pm 
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An update from my session at the local TAO on Friday...

By the way, I brought a witness with me and audio recorded the entire event.

No documents were provided to me specifically detailing exactly which FRP was being assessed against me. I left with no 8278, no 12775 and no Master file transcript. She did print out an "Account Transcript", exactly like those found through the online portal which was of no use, of course.

All in all, the agent was seemingly genuine and did her best to dig deeper into the issue and was quite intrigued by the situation and eager to learn more about it.. She did claim there was only so much she could access, not sure if to believe that or not.

It was a polite and rather humorous 34 minute session and I did get verbal admission that at least to the depth with which the employee could search transcripts and other forms there exists NO 6020(b) or any pertinent administrative approval form relating to the assessments made against me.

Let me know what you think about this!

Send me a private message if you're interested in the audio I have it saved MP3 and I will send it to you upon request.


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 17, 2019 10:18 pm 
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James,

My FOIA response guy said that 12775 is now obsolete.

I will be going to my local office in a couple weeks for the same deal, how do I PM you? Or connect with me on Telegram and you can send it there: https://t.me/btchersh

You and your witness should now sign an affidavit stating that no docs were provided to back the assessment of your FRP. Hopefully you got her name and badge #.

No 6020(b) return = No Legal FRP!

Pete writes about it here:
http://losthorizons.com/FRP/6020(b)AndFRPs.htm (may have to copy and paste link) ,
Quote:
IT'S THIS SIMPLE, FOLKS: A sworn and signed 6020(b) return declaring liability for the penalty is a core requirement for the assessment of the penalty. Period. The law is perfectly clear on this requirement.

The "frivolous return" penalty provided for at 26 U.S.C. § 6702 is to be assessed in the same manner as the income tax generally:

26 U.S.C. § 6671. Rules for application of assessable penalties

(a) Penalty assessed as tax

The penalties and liabilities provided by this subchapter [which includes section 6702 -PH] shall be paid upon notice and demand by the Secretary, and shall be assessed and collected in the same manner as taxes. Except as otherwise provided, any reference in this title to “tax” imposed by this title shall be deemed also to refer to the penalties and liabilities provided by this subchapter


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 21, 2019 9:11 am 
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Chad - Great idea with the affidavit and yes I did get her name and badge number!

Good to know about form 12775.

I'm not entirely sure how you can PM me but there seems to be an option for it under the " User Control Panel". You may have to enable it in your settings, I had to.

I also have made you a friend under the forum control panel.. Perhaps, we must be friends to PM each other?

Anyways, I will send the audio to you via telegram. After work I will get an account and forward it to you, I'm pretty busy this time year as the Maple syrup season has begun here in the green mountains...

YES, NO 6020(b) NO FRP.

Keep up the good work I'm very interested in hearing about your outcome with the you local TAO.


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